Angela Barnard cover

Can developing the tiny house mindset help you start tiny living sooner? What is the tiny house mindset anyway? My guest Angela Barnard is not only a tiny dweller but a life and career coach who specializes in helping people change the direction of their lives. In this interview, Angela gives us the Be – Act – Have framework and explains how to use it to become a tiny dweller… even if you‘re not living tiny yet! I was really inspired by this conversation and I think you will be too!

In This Episode:

  • You can entertain in your tiny home without feeling cramped
  • Are you doing it backward? Angela's tips for living intentionally
  • Which habits set tiny homeowners apart?
  • Becoming who you want to be using the power of your mind
  • How Angela financed her tiny home
  • Using your tiny home mindset in other areas of your life
  • What do values have to do with home design?

Links and Resources:

Guest Bio:

Angela Barnard

Angela Barnard

Angela Barnard is a Life & Career Coach. She helps purpose-driven people gain clarity on the direction they want to take their lives and develop the habits and systems they need to be who they want to be. She lives in a tiny house in South Carolina and is the host of The Intentional Mind Podcast, a podcast all about intentionally designing your life using the power of your mind, faith, and energy. When she isn’t coaching, you can find her role-playing a journalist in crisis training exercises with the U.S. Army, hiking, or traveling galore with her husband.




This Week's Sponsor:

Precision Temp Logo


PrecisionTemp is making one product to solve two issues that I know everyone deals with in a tiny house: running out of hot water and heating your tiny house. PrecisionTemp has made the amazing TwinTemp Junior propane tankless water heater, which provides unlimited hot water for your tiny house and hydronic heating. This means you get warm heated floors, so there are no cold spots. It's designed specifically for tiny houses and features whisper-quiet operation as well as high efficiency. If you want more information on how PrecisionTemp can help make living tiny easier and more comfortable visit While you're there, use the coupon code THLP for $100 off the TwinTemp Junior plus free shipping.


More Photos:

Many windows make the tiny house look large

An open floorplan allows for entertaining multiple guests

A screened-in front porch was a must-have, along with a back deck


Angela Barnard 0:00

We have people that stay here like we've had six people come over and stay and you're not on top of each other. It's just because everything's designed so intentionally. When people walk in they're really shocked that like, they feel like it's so much bigger and they're like, "Wow, maybe I can do this."

Ethan Waldman 0:16

Welcome to the Tiny House Lifestyle Podcast, the show where you learn how to plan, build and live the tiny lifestyle. I'm your host, Ethan Waldman, and this is episode 168 with Angela Barnard. Can developing the tiny house mindset help you start living tiny sooner? What is the tiny house mindset anyway? My guest Angela Barnard is not only a tiny dweller, but a life and career coach who specializes in helping people change the direction of their lives. In this interview, Angela gives us the Be-Act-Have framework and explains how to use it to become a tiny dweller, even if you're not living tiny yet. I was really inspired by this conversation and I think you will be too so stick around.

I'd like to tell you about the sponsor of today's episode, PrecisionTemp. PrecisionTemp is making one product to solve two issues that I know everyone deals with in a tiny house - running out of hot water and heating your tiny house. PrecisionTemp has made the amazing TwinTemp Jr. propane tankless water heater, which provides unlimited hot water for your tiny house and hydronic heating. This means you get warm heated floors, so there are no cold spots. It's designed specifically for tiny houses and features whisper-quiet operation as well as high efficiency. If you want more information on how PrecisionTemp can help make living tiny easier, and more comfortable, visit While you're there, use the coupon code THLPfor $100 off the TwinTemp Jr plus free shipping. That website again is coupon code THLP for $100 off the TwinTemp Jr. plus free shipping. Thank you so much to PrecisionTemp for sponsoring our show.

All right, I am here with Angela Barnard. Angela is a life and career coach. She helps purpose driven people gain clarity on the direction they want to take their lives and develop the habits and systems they need to be who they want to be. She lives in a tiny house in South Carolina, and is the host of the Intentional Mind podcast, a podcast all about intentionally designing your life using the power of your mind faith and energy. When she isn't coaching, you can find her role playing a journalist in crisis training exercises with the US Army, hiking, or traveling with her husband. Angela Barnard, welcome to the show.

Angela Barnard 2:54

Thanks for having me. Excited to be here.

Ethan Waldman 2:56

Yeah, excited to have you. So I love what you're doing. But I want to start with your your tiny story. How long have you been living tiny? And what, you know, why did you decide to go tiny?

Angela Barnard 3:08

I've been living tiny for just over a year. And the decision was made because my husband and I, we moved from coastal South Carolina up closer to North Carolina, in the Greenville area. And we were looking for a home and we were shopping and at that point in time, we were really wanting to pay off all of our debt. So when we started hearing that in the area, you're expected to pay, you know, $200,000 - $300,00, for a home, we were like, "You don't want to go in that much more debt when we're on this journey to pay off our debt." And I've always like loved the idea of living tiny and like focusing on, you know, some simplicity and just really living your life focused on experiences and having more of those versus more things. So that whole concept that was really interesting.

And when I found out how much the houses were going for, and then I'm on this journey to pay off that my husband and I were like, no, like, "We don't even need a house that big." and the realtor kept showing us all these homes, and they were huge. And we're like, this just feels reckless and dumb. And it's not in alignment with with for us at the time with our goals. So we ended up finding a tiny home, it was like a random thing. In the middle of the night. I got this like a notification because I put up this notification or the setting to see homes that were under a certain price range, and tiny home popped up. And I was like, "What?!" and I saw that there was this community and I was like, "I want to go see this community." So we ended up going to see this community and the community was pretty big. It was about 70 homes in it. And we're like, "Oh we kind of want to live more like these people." So they're like, "Oh, we have this new one down the road." So there was, I think like eight at the time and now in our community there's 10 Tiny Homes. So we purchased the tiny You home. And we moved into this little community and we're on the lake. And it's been a year since then. And we're loving it.

Ethan Waldman 5:06

Nice. So your tiny home is a moveable house on a trailer.

Angela Barnard 5:10

Yes, yes.

Ethan Waldman 5:11

Okay. And so was it difficult to find a tiny home to buy? Because I know, like a year ago, and now still, it can be really difficult to find a tiny house.

Angela Barnard 5:24

Yeah, I'm hearing that a lot from people, especially even in this area that someone was going to move in. And there was over a six month wait. Probably even more now with like the cost of wood and how things are going given COVID. And also, you know, the domino effect of all of that. But at our time, I think we were like, right at the point where, before there was real issues with it. So we had our home, we purchased, we had it built, and we kind of add some custom things to it and stuff. And it was built in like less than two months. I felt like we just got into it at that like perfect timing.

Ethan Waldman 5:59

Wow, that's amazing. And so how, give me some stats, like how long is it? How wide is it? What are some features?

Angela Barnard 6:07

it's 395 square feet, okay. And it has, you know, the back the back room that I'm in now. So there's the back room. And then we have the loft, and I also have a front porch, that's all screened in. And then we added based on our values of like wanting to have community and like people over we like a deck in the back and you have like this really just cool hangout spot in the back. And, yeah, we've really made it so that we could have a lot of people here. We are like the party people in our community as far as like hosting the gatherings and things. The people in our village, that's what we call it, they usually come over here, and we'll have like bonfires in the back. So we have like, like an eight person picnic table. And it's just set up to host fun. And we have all the bar lights and everything and we just love it.

Ethan Waldman 6:54

I love that. I mean, it's, I would say, on the surface, you might think that living tiny means that you can't have people over.

Angela Barnard 7:03

Yeah, but obviously you can and like literally like I take pictures of there was we were doing this fun little party thing where we would go from like each tiny home would have like appetizers and everything. And everyone in the community would move along and get appetizers that each tiny home. And I took this picture and there's literally like 25 people in our little tiny home. They're like all gathered around, and it seriously like it the way that but um, you know, such efficient use of space that you really do have that space where people can like be in there together. And yeah, I am the person that's proving it wrong, that you can't have that sense of community and like people here and we have people that stay here like we've had six people come over and today and you're not on top of each other. It's just because everything's designed so intentionally. When people walk in, they're really shocked that like, they feel like it's so much bigger, and they're like, "Wow, maybe I can do this." You know?

Ethan Waldman 8:00

Yeah, yeah, totally. So you're, you think you have people over who are thinking about tiny houses or just like seeing what you're doing and feeling like, oh, maybe this is doable for me.

Angela Barnard 8:12

Yeah, all the time. I mean, in our community, people drive in, and we're like, oh, there's the lookers, you know, like they want to go around and see the Tiny Homes and everyone our commute like tiny home people, you know, anyone that's listening, like tiny young people are so excited about their Tiny Homes, and they are very happy, in my experience to show you what they've created what they've done with their space. So we've been that people to like letting people come through and just showing them, you know, how we've organized our clothing and like how we've taken advantage of like, smaller spaces and designed them very intentionally to store stuff. And I'm how we have our two cats in our home with us. And we created like this cat walkway at the top. Like there's windows and they can like chill and look outside and walk around from like they get they get on it from the lockdown tab. And then even like my litter box, my litter box even is like one of the most popular things was tiny homeowners because it's especially I mean, if you have cats, they it's a plant one. So it looks like a big plant pack, you know, but then it's like an actual litterboxes disguise with like this beautiful plants and stuff. So it's just a nice, like in a small space. You have to be so intentional. But yeah, we have people and I've had people that find out that I have a tiny home that want to call me and talk to me on the phone about it just to pick my brain.

Ethan Waldman 9:28

But yeah, that's awesome. And it sounds like you're an enthusiastic, tiny dweller. So thanks for being willing to share with people.

Angela Barnard 9:36

I definitely am.

Ethan Waldman 9:39

Because I can imagine that it would get it could get tiresome, you know, people just kind of looking in your windows all the time.

Angela Barnard 9:46

Yeah, but it's like,it's fun, though. Like I guess like I have that. I think it's fun to like show people - my husband - but it's I guess it's based on your personality because like, I'm like, "People are here! Let's ask them if they want to come in and see this" or whatever. And he's like, "Oh, I'm just trying to eat dinner." Yeah, I guess it depends on your personality.

Ethan Waldman 10:04

Yeah, I can I can see who's the introvert in this relationship. So, I want to talk about kind of living intentionally as a mindset. And it sounds like for you and for many people that like living tiny, almost forces you to live intentionally.

Angela Barnard 10:25


Ethan Waldman 10:26

Can you say more about that?

Angela Barnard 10:28

Yeah. So a big reason why I really wanted to go tiny wasn't just because of the financial reasons where I wanted to, like I had that intention to pay off our debt and have more financial freedom. So I wasn't like house broke, as some people are, you know, like, I didn't want all my money tied up in my home. But another big reason was because of my huge value around being intentional with my life, and even the things I own and what is in my space, I really believe that from living in a tiny home, you are forced, in a sense, to be intentional with what you bring in because you are limited on space. And this ends up bleeding into other areas of your life. It's like, like, you know, how they say, like, how you do anything, is how you do everything. That's how I feel it's kind of been like in my life, because I am intentional about what goes in my space. I'm also intentional with my life in general, like, what goes in my body? What, as far as what I'm eating, you know, who I surround myself with? What goes in my mind what I fill my mind up with? So it's like, I just love it, because I feel like being in this tiny home makes me be more of who I want to be.

Ethan Waldman 11:37

I love that. I love that. Would you say that? So so in your bio, you mentioned that you you help people develop habits and systems that they need to be who they want to be? What? What habits and systems have you developed? To live tiny and to help you thrive living tiny?

Angela Barnard 11:59

Oh, that's a great question. So I'll share a little bit about like, my process of helping people. So the very first thing is to be clear about the kind of person you want to be. So we've been talking about being this like intentional person, so you get clear on the identity that you want to have. And then really thinking if I am that person, then how do I show up every day, and what's the what are the habits of someone that is intentional with their life?

And then you know, that leads to results. So they're in, I feel like a lot of people when it comes to their goals, they do this backwards way of going after their goals that is not in alignment with how the mind works, I teach a lot around how the mind works. And when it comes to goals, identity based is always going to serve you because if you think I am this kind of person, then I behave as though so just a quick example is when we talk about Tiny Homes, like someone will say like, you know, "I really would love a tiny house. And when I have a tiny house, then I can be really intentional about my stuff and what I own, then I can have more freedom, more financial freedom, so then I could travel more, and then I could," you know, like all these things that they could have. The issue with that is they say when I have that, then I'll be that kind of person. And that's not how the mind works, how the mind works, this is more of a not, when I have then I act that way.

And then I be it's actually the opposite is I be this way now. And then I act that way. Like I'm this kind of person, I think like that kind of person had the habits of them. And then I have the results that I'm looking for. So there's a model that I teach is called the Be-Act-Have Recipe, and I do this with myself, and this helps me come up with my own habit. So let's say I actually did this, like I also teach around like vision boards and like getting clear, obviously on the vision that you have. So one of the things I did before I got my tiny home, I said, "I am a tiny home owner. And if I was a tiny home owner, how do I behave every day? What are my habits?" So for me, I thought, okay, the tiny homeowners that and if anyone's ever confused, like you're like, well, what are their habits, sometimes you have to ask them or you listen to what they say. So for me, I noticed that people that lived in Tiny Homes, they were really intentional about what they own. The people I know are really big about quality, like having quality items, because it's less items that they have. So they're like looking when they need something, they don't just go out and buy it. They're very intentional about finding the perfect item to fit in the space. I've heard a lot of them switching things out, you know, get a new shirt. I'm going to get rid of another shirt because I'm limited on space. So these are habits that how they show up.

They're also intentional with their time and I've seen a lot that are very creative, at least in my community. Almost every person in my community is really creative and they've made spaces to do their creative work. So what I say if these are some of the habits But we're noticing and also intentional with our, with their time, just this, this intentional aspect to them. So I think about instead of waiting until I have my home to be that way, be intentional with my space and my time or my money or my schedule, I show up as that kind of person now. Right, I have those habits now. And then I will become that person. So I was like adapting this mentality of identifying as a tiny homeowner already, even before I even got a tiny home, visioning in my mind what it would be like to have a tiny home what would be like to live in a tiny home and developing those habits. I started like clearing out my space being intentional, even though I had at the time I had a four bedroom home. But I was being way more intentional about what was in my home. So those are the habits that I was starting to develop. And then before I knew it, like I had my vision board that I wanted to be, you know, have my tiny home. And before I knew I had a tiny home, I'm living in it. And I feel like I'm thriving in it, because I was already starting to be that person. Does that make sense?

Ethan Waldman 15:57

Yeah, totally. And you did a great job of giving an example of that kind of the backwards nature that people get stuck in like, oh, once I have this, then I can be that kind of person.

Angela Barnard 16:09

Yeah. And you can deal with any goal. I mean, really any, you can break it down with any kind of goal like I, for the longest time, I remember, I used to say that I wanted to be a writer. But if someone was like, Well, hey, do you actually write? Like, do you have a hat? Do you have the habits of a writer? Do you act like a writer? And you'd be like, no. So therefore you will not be your writer. And I always give that example. Because the goal is never like people like to say the goal is to like write a book. But no, truly the goal is to be a writer. And when you bring it back on side, the goal is to be a tiny home dweller or tiny home owner. Like that's the actual goal. So then you develop the habits of that.

Ethan Waldman 16:47

Yeah, I like that a lot. What about like, day to day? I'm thinking more just like nitty gritty, maybe less exciting habits and systems. You know, do you you work from home in your tiny house? Yeah. And does your husband also work from home in your tiny house?

Angela Barnard 17:06

No. Okay. So, as far as like my habits daily, um, I am just really, I have this whole system developed around like, taking care of my like, you know, I'm doing the typical homeowner things that we all do, we have to do laundry, we have to get our food, we have to do all those things. So like during the week, I've set up like on Mondays when I plan meals, Tuesdays in the house. And then like I have set days that I'm doing things that fit into my schedule.

And then I have a solid morning routine that I've developed in an evening routine. And my morning routine involves, I like to include these three things of mindfulness movement, and mastery, like I'm moving forward and some something that I want to grow on or something I want to learn. So I do those three things in the morning. And in my home, like I have, before I moved in, I got really clear around my values and what I wanted my life to look like. So I was intentional about the things I brought in my home. So for example, the writing that I do in the morning, I wanted to make sure I had a place that I could write podcasting, just like you even like I wanted, I had my space for me to podcast, that was really intentional about setting that up. And that's a big part like environment has a huge role in you following through with habit. So when you just get clear on that vision of who you want to be think about how you can set up your environment.

And in my home, I have like I have this area where I call this my writing chair, where I'm going to be writing, I set up things like my hot water in the morning. So it's already set up my notebook is out for me to write in the morning. And I'm really big about like preparing that. So it's like I'm, I'm primed to do it, it's a reminder when I see those items. So that's a big part of like my everyday routine. Cool.

Ethan Waldman 18:58

I was gonna ask you to do to do another example. And this is one that I have struggled with. And you know, though I don't my wife and I don't live in the tiny home that I built in 2012 anymore. We do live with kind of a tiny mentality in a pretty tiny condo. In terms of like, we just don't have the space to bring in really much of anything at this point, though. It's it's, we're pretty intentional about about that. But one thing that I found hasn't changed is that I feel busy, like I'm busier than I want to be. And I'm and I'm sure that I've fallen into the trap of being like, "Oh, if only I had, you know, oh, if I had a house with a garage, I'd be less busy." Or like, "If I only had like a backyard" we don't have like our own yard here. That's like all shared says like, "If I only had like my own outdoor space, I would somehow be less busy." How would you flip that one on its head?

Angela Barnard 19:59

So you If only I had this, then I would be left with. Yeah. So I think with that from a mental aspect is, yeah, getting clear around the kind of person you want to be. So you don't want to be the busy person. So you tell me what kind of person do you want to be?

Ethan Waldman 20:18

Right? I want to be the person that has a lot of flexibility in their schedule, so that when a friend or family member needs help, or you get a last minute invite to go on a hike or go for a bike ride, you don't have other plans that you kind of maybe never really thought about that much. They just kind of you're just calendars just full.

Angela Barnard 20:42

Okay? So then you would be like, in a sense, you're this at you are an entrepreneur, so you'd be this entrepreneur that has freedom in their schedule to do whatever they want to do. Like, and actually, so that's the identities you own this identity. So what I would suggest if I was coaching someone like you, when you told me this, I would say, Okay, this is who you want to be, your actual goal is, this is the identity that you want to have. But right now, you identify as the person that's busy, and that doesn't have that. And therefore you create the results of that data, it really comes back to how the mind works. So then we go to like this is you want to be the entrepreneur that has freedom in their time to do anything thing that they want. And they feel that peace and freedom. So then what I would suggest is you analyze someone who is that who has that, and what are their habits. So I'll give you an example of like, I'm sure you know John Lee Dumas right? From his podcast. What is it?

Ethan Waldman 21:39

Entrepreneur on Fire?

Angela Barnard 21:40

Yeah. Okay, so John Lee Dumas, he is someone to me that I'm like, 'Whoa, he has so much freedom." And he talks about, like, how he works like five days a month. And you know, but if you look at his habits, because habits are he's about really intentional with his time. And he batches things together. And he even has people who, that he has virtual assistants that he works with from the Philippines. And these are like habits that he's developed. He's developed, like, he's coaching these virtual assistants, he batches his things. He thinks like, I don't need, like, I heard him saying in an interview that he makes like $2 million a year. And he actually says, "I know how to make more. But I don't feel like I need to, like I want freedom is more important to me, just to experience my life and be with people I love." And that's an also a belief that he's adopted.

So I even get people to look at the beliefs and the way that you look, you know what their thinking, is by listening to what they're saying. So when I have this recipe of Be-Act-Have, I make you fill it out. So the first thing would be the be part like you would say, I wouldn't be this entrepreneur with, with all this freedom to do what I want. So that's the identity. And if you were the, where I asked you to also write down the belief that they would have. And then if you believe that, how do you act? How do you spend your money? How do you spend your time, what are your resources, and then that gives you the results of the ultimate having that you want, which is the freedom to be with the people that you love and to enjoy your life. So this is how this model can be so helpful to all of us with any of our goals. Very cool.

Ethan Waldman 23:14

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Have you coached people who are wanting to live tiny?

Angela Barnard 24:50

Yeah, actually do that. Like I have a client right now that I'm working with and I was coaching her in conjunction with another company that builds Tiny Homes. So My job was helping her like, deal with the mindset change, and this whole identity shift, because let's be real, you are changing truly who you identify as you're changing your lifestyle completely. And a lot of stuff will come up with that a lot of resistance like mentally just because of how the mind works. Yeah. So recently I've been working with her and a big thing is she's trying to simplify and gets overwhelming for a lot of people like simplify all their stuff to go into this small space. Yeah. And she's like, I don't know what I should focus on what I should bring in all of that. And, and she's like, how do I make this decision? Should I be shopping for certain things? Like, I just feel overwhelmed by it. And I said, it comes back to you telling me, how do you want to live your life? In this next chapter? What kind of person do you want to be? What are your values, what's important to you, because that's going to determine what you have in your space.

So an example would be like, for me, even going back to habit, one of the things I really value is my health. So when I was getting my tiny home and building it, I was like, I need to have a space where I can actually move around and work out every day. Like I need a place for my week, I value personal development and growth, I need a place where I'm going to be learning where I can have my podcast. So when I designed my home, it was done very intentionally. And the same thing with my husband, like as far as what are his values? How does he want to grow? Who does he want to be, and really making sure that we developed our home with that in mind, and the same thing goes, and I was talking about the deck earlier, and our bonfire pit and all of that I really value community, that's important to me. So in my tiny home space, how can I honor that?

So I've been helping her through that journey of getting clarity around her values, and how she wants this next chapter of her life look like create a vision for her. And then from that, we'd be very intentional about what you bring into the space and how you set up your space. And if you're working on becoming a certain person, then I also look at how to prime your brain and trigger your brain to be that person. So like I said earlier, like, if I know that I want to be a writer, then I'm going to have prompts out like things that make my brain be like, Oh, yeah, there's the notebook. That's when you sit down, you know, and then write then build the habit together with like, right after I make my coffee, because I already have the habit of coffee. So then I get into like the mental stuff. And that's like a deeper thing. But it always comes back to that Be-Act-Have that you can use for anything.

Ethan Waldman 27:17

Be-Act-Have. I like that, I think that would be a really important exercise for anybody listening who thinks that they want to live tiny, to really explore that further. And to maybe look at, like, what am I What am I putting off becoming right now that I think I need the tiny house to do to be?

Angela Barnard 27:42

Yeah, and I would advise you like taking advantage of things that have offerings, where there's a community of people that are already tiny homeowners that are also part of that community, or they have the like mindedness around wanting to live in a tiny home. Yeah, because you know, the research shows that you are the average of the five. And this is so true. When you look at how the brain works, the brain is all about like your mirror neurons, mapping behavior to the more if you want to be a certain kind of person or have a certain lifestyle, you need to it's completely crucial to you being that person to surround yourself with other people that you want to be like. So I think that's really important to consider, like when you're thinking about all of us with our goals is like, "Where are the people that already have those things? And how can I spend more time with them, so I can train my brain to be like them?"

Ethan Waldman 28:31

What did you mean by 'you are the five'?

Angela Barnard 28:34

So you've probably I think it was Jim Rohn. Who said, that's, I mean, you hear it quoted all the time. So you're the average of the five that you spend the most time with, okay, so if you think about if you're spending research over and over, we'll show this. Like, if you spend time with people that have really unhealthy eating habits, or overweight or whatever, you're going to be just like that. Same thing with finances, you'll make about the same amount of income as the people that you spend the most time with. So I like when I was thinking about being a tiny home owner, I was like, Where are the other tiny home owners? How can I spend time with them? And where are the ones that are actually living a life that I want to have a similar to mine? Because I will be like them? Because my brain is gonna fall out Mac their behavior just by being around them listening to them. But like, after a while you will you will be that person.

Ethan Waldman 29:25

Yeah. And so were you able to find tiny homeowners to hang out with?

Angela Barnard 29:30

Yeah, so after I got the idea that I wanted to live in a tiny home, then I started just connecting with people online that were already living in Tiny Homes, picking their brains learning more about it actually came into our community. And that was one of the lookers that went around and like looked at everybody's homes and connected with them. And even to this day, like I'm still connecting with other tiny homeowners or people that are interested in this whole field of like, living in a tiny home, home or serving tiny homeowners and all.

Ethan Waldman 30:00

That's very cool. Yeah, I just love how proactive you you are or were and are about it. And now you're kind of returning the favor to other people to the, to the other lookers?

Angela Barnard 30:13

Yeah. I think because I think it's so important. Like when I'm all about helping people intentionally design their life, and you really do, I recommend creating that little recipe for yourself. And when you get to that Be part about who you want to be, find them, because a lot of times you will need to study them, because you're like, what habits do they have? And a lot of times you don't know, and you don't know what they're thinking or how they live their life. Because it's, it's a different identity than you have. It's a different lifestyle. So in order for you to be intentional, like that, I think it means it's like, you're intentionally designing your life. And there's a recipe to doing that. And that will always include you, surrounding yourself with the people that you want to be like, and I'm sure you can relate to this, like we wanted the podcast, let's just say, you know, how when I also had the identity that I wanted to be a podcaster. And I didn't identify as that initially, because I wasn't I got in groups with other podcasters, surrounding myself with them started learning from them.

Ethan Waldman 31:08

Awesome. And then you became one. Exactly. I want to ask you, you know, as a career coach, do you see? Maybe do you see any correlations between times when people change their careers and wanting to live tiny?

Angela Barnard 31:27

Yeah, definitely. I've seen a lot with my clients, when I'm coaching around just career stuff. And I'm not even mentioning anything around a tiny home. But when they find out that I live in a tiny home, they're like, oh, like, I want to change my whole career. And I also just want to be, I attract a lot of people who want to be more intentional with their life in general. So they're like, they see that as a means to just being intentional, in general, having a tiny home and wanting to be intentional with that. And that will also help them be intentional with their work. And in my experience, like I said before, it's like that it bleeds into everything else, like people that live in Tiny Homes that I connect with, they are intentional about pretty much everything all now that's been my experience of it.

Ethan Waldman 32:10

This is actually a question from Tiny House Engage. So from the chat, what is one big challenge that you have personally faced while being intentional? Or have that you have faced through intentionality? Or with intention?

Angela Barnard 32:23

Oh, that's, that's such a good question. The one that I faced and I faced it over and over is not just the resistance to it not identifying as I'm not feeling like I'm worthy to be that person. So one of the examples is I'm on the journey. Right now, I just finished applying for a TED talk. So that was nice. That's a big thing. And it brings up a lot of brings up a lot of my own fear. So when I'm like, Oh, I'm a TEDx speaker, like I this is what I have people do is, when they set their goals, they turn them all into identity based goals.

Yeah, I mean, without me geeking out about like, cuz I can go on neuroscience about it forever. So I won't do that for you guys. But I'm all about doing that. So I can start to train my brain to be that person, because what will happen is, I will start to look for opportunities to be that person. But this is what I have found, when I do this with my goals. And I'm like, I am this person. Initially, I will feel resistance to that. My mind will be like, no, you're not, that's not going to happen for you. It's not possible for you. I felt the same thing with my tiny house when I was like, I am a tiny homeowner, it's like, no, you're not how is that gonna happen? I mean, realistically, like all of that stuff shows up to that chatter that goes against it. And I have to work with that all the time.

So one of the things I have found, that is really helpful to me, and I write this down every day is I write down Why am I so instead of like, I'm a TEDx speaker, it's like, why am I a TEDx speaker. And what I have found is, my, my brain doesn't fight back on that as much and it wants me It starts having me look for opportunities to be that person. And then I go back into my recipe, and I'm like, who do I need to surround myself with? How do I just start to look for opportunity to be more of that I did the same thing with the tiny home. Why am I a tiny homeowner? And I was like, oh, because I'm starting to be because I've been connecting with people. I've asked a lot about it. And as I see more evidence of that, it's like this domino effect that starts to be, but I know, every single day, you will face resistance to changing your lifestyle. It's just how it is because you're not owning that identity now.

Ethan Waldman 34:24

Got it. Yeah. It seems like you kind of are you almost have to trick yourself into into believing it.

Angela Barnard 34:31

Yeah, it's like I think about it as you train yourself. Like, we're all training ourselves to be some kind of person, but who are you training to be? Because whatever you practice, over and over, you're gonna get really good at but what you're actually doing is you're programming your mind to Yeah, so you can think about it as if we're practicing being intentional with our spaces and putting things away very intentionally. We are becoming an intentional person, but if we're practicing throwing things all over the place We are programming our mind to be the person that doesn't value our stuff.

Ethan Waldman 35:05

Right? It's funny, I got a puppy two months ago. And it's the same thing in dog training, any behaviors that they rehearse they get really good at. So yeah, the goal is to stop them from ever jumping up on the counter because you've got a pen in the kitchen, rather than yelling at them after they jump up on the counter because they've just practiced that behavior that you don't want them to do. Yeah. Like, you have to train yourself to be your own trainer. Exactly. I was curious, actually, kind of jumping back in the interview a little bit to your your own kind of tiny journey. You mentioned wanting to pay off your debt. And I was curious, have you or How's it going?

Angela Barnard 35:48

We are officially debt free. So my husband and I have paid together off over $300,000 worth of student loans. Wow. And we just last month paid off our tiny home. Nice. So we don't have any debt. And it feels so freeing. Like, I can't that is like one of the best feelings to feel like, I feel like I can. Just being in this home was one of the best decisions I made, because it really led to so many of my other dreams coming true.

Ethan Waldman 36:17

You mentioned that you paid off your tiny house. How do you know what? How were you able to finance your tiny house?

Angela Barnard 36:24

Oh, okay. That's a good question. So we, when we financed our tiny home, how we financed it was okay, so a lot of people out there probably have realized that you've been digging and trying to find loans for Tiny Homes and things like that, yeah, it can be quite a challenge to get a loan for a tiny home, just by the nature of it. And yeah, not getting into all of that. But basically, for us, what we decided to do was we hunted around, we found a bank that was willing to finance half of it. And then we got the other half from So basically, we went to two different banks and got two different loans for half of it. So then we were paying on each of the loans. And that's how we were able to pay it off.

Ethan Waldman 37:08

And were they like RV style loans, or were they just kind of like personal loans.

Angela Barnard 37:14

They were personal loans. Yeah, they were not RV style. I'm pretty sure they were both personal loans. Okay.

Ethan Waldman 37:19

Yeah. So it's I always like to ask, because unless certain builders are able to offer financing through different lenders, and there there are v style loans that are usually like 567 year loans with fairly high interest rates. And so I'm always curious, people still have to get creative to figure out how to finance the tiny house.

Angela Barnard 37:42

Yeah, you definitely have to get creative. And that's the stuff that that pops up on our journey. It's like, if you're like, you're determined to be this tiny home owner, the resistance is going to show up against you not being that person. And that's just the nature of any goal. Yeah. And I feel like we're there's a will, there's a way, so just keep searching for different ways. And like, that's what we ended up doing was getting the two different loans. And they were actually a fairly low interest rate on both of them. So we had all the intention to pay him off, like as quickly as possible. And we did.

Ethan Waldman 38:13

Right, right. So now that you are debt free, are you do you see tiny living as a long term thing that you're going to do? Or do you have your sights set on maybe like a slightly less tiny abode.

Angela Barnard 38:28

So I love Tiny Home living, and it's gonna be really hard, I feel like for me to transition out of the tiny home lifestyle, but with where my husband and I are at, like, we want to eventually have children. And we realize like in this, like, we don't want to do Tiny Home living with all of our children into the space. I know, it totally can be done, people rock it out. And they're great with it. But just for our choices like we don't we want to, we still want to live here intentionally with a small space, because we've seen how you can do it. But I think our next step after we move out of a tiny home is to custom build our own small home that's bigger than our tiny home, but still way smaller than your average. I'm talking like 1000 square feet, you know, way smaller than your average huge home that people live in.

Ethan Waldman 39:15

Nice. Nice. I like that carrying the tiny living lessons forward.

Angela Barnard 39:21

Yeah. And then even just, you know, having Airbnb where we have our own tiny home so that we can share the joy of tiny home living and just really getting people to see what it's like to live in one and because I think when you come into these, you start to realize it's a lot more possible than what you would think if you haven't actually been in one or stayed in one.

Ethan Waldman 39:41

Yeah, it is. It always is. and ours is to earn ours is under 200 square feet. It's 220 with the loft. But when you say that people are like, you know, I've seen closets that are bigger, but it doesn't feel that way. There's a lot of windows. The design is intentional.

Angela Barnard 39:58

Yeah, it's all about the design. It truly always comes back to that. And like, I always say, like, vertical is your friend, like really just remembering that when it comes to how you're designing things like stacking things on top of each other, like the shelves and mirrors and the windows that makes it so much more space, spacious feeling.

Ethan Waldman 40:17

Nice, nice. Well, one thing that I like to ask all of my guests is what what are two or three resources that you that have helped you on Your Tiny House journey that you'd like to share with with our listeners?

Angela Barnard 40:29

I think I'm a tiny home journey. Well, let me think about this. Everything like this may sound weird, but like the things that I when I was getting my tiny home, I was all about like, well, looking on Pinterest and things like that. But I was really more focused on being intentional about creating like a vision board for what I was looking like what I wanted for my home. And I think that really helps. If you're going to build, whether you're going to build your own or you're going to get a builder, it's such a helpful resource for you to just have images of that have thought it out and put it into something tangible that you can look at. So I would just recommend creating some visual thing for yourself. And then really getting clear on what your values are. If you're someone that is not sure you don't have words, describe your values, you can always use Google's like values assessment just to find words, and the words are based on your own definition. This is important because in my work, what I've seen with people is people that are like, either unfulfilled in their life in general, or just even in their careers, it always comes back to two things, it comes back to not living life in alignment with your values, or not living life in alignment in a way that honors your strength. And when you are thinking of making this this transition into tiny home living, get clean, find the resources, get clear on those values and what your strengths are. So you can consider that and the design of your home so that you can be honoring those.

Ethan Waldman 41:58

Yeah, I echo that because it is tiny. So it kind of locks you in. So if your values are like, always wanting to have a space to do crafts, if if you don't design that space, you're not going to have it.

Angela Barnard 42:13

Yep, exactly. Yep. And then location and really consider this beyond just your actual physical, tiny home, but your location and what's in your surrounding, as far as honoring your values.

Ethan Waldman 42:24

Yeah. And that's that's another challenge, because it can be difficult to find a place to park a tiny home, would you recommend? I mean, I guess on your journey, you kind of decided on the tiny home first, and then you found where you wanted to put it, right.

Angela Barnard 42:42

So we well, we decided on actually it was like the opposite. So we just the location, and then we were able to find the home and like figure out what we wanted in that location.

Ethan Waldman 42:55

Yeah. So you you actually found where it would go. And then that helped you kind of envision the whole whole thing.

Angela Barnard 43:03

Yeah, and I recommend, so when it comes to getting your tiny home, the location like before, even when people are talking to us about like, and I have worked with other people around helping them design their Tiny Homes, and just hearing the vision of what they want for their home. And I'm always asking, like, where are you going to put this thing? And is it okay with zoning, like you find that answer? And then we'll talk more about it. Because I think that's just one of the things that you should do sooner. And you should be considering before you even get the home built. Yeah, yeah.

Ethan Waldman 43:34

Yeah, I mean, a lot of people go many different ways on that some kind of choose to just not find out and not know, and just kind of try to slide under the radar. But depending on where you go, that might not be possible.

Angela Barnard 43:47

Yeah. And I've seen working with people who purchase Tiny Homes, I see a lot of them, do the opposite, where they they're building their home. And then when it comes to putting it somewhere, they're really struggling. And there's been times that we were we're trying to help them figure out where they're going to put it because they haven't thought of that or they thought they did but then they found out was zoning that it couldn't go there and it causes more issues. Yeah. So I think consider where do you want to put your tiny home, consider the weather of that location. It's really important as far as how you're building your home, and also consider insurance. Because that's another thing that can be really tricky for people to find. Um, so do your hunt on what that insurance, I mean what's going to cover your home.

Ethan Waldman 44:28

Well, Angela Barnard, thank you so much. This has been such a great conversation and I really appreciate you taking the time.

Angela Barnard 44:38

Thank you so much.

Ethan Waldman 44:39

Thank you so much to Angela Barnard for being a guest on the show today. You can find the show notes including a full transcript of the episode and links to Angela Bernards website and podcasts at 168. Again, that's 168.

Thanks also to PrecisionTemp for sponsoring today's show. Don't forget to head over to and use the coupon code THLP for $100 off the TwinTemp Junior hot water heater, plus free shipping.

Well, that's all for this week. I'm your host, Ethan Waldman, and I'll be back next week with another episode of the Tiny House Lifestyle Podcast.

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